My MK1&2 body shell has a hole up by the top of the window that I will use for the shoulder harness.  I know it is a little high, but it is usable.  I reinforced the back of the post with the metal in the picture.  It slides down the post and has a nut welded to the back.  My nephew who is an engineer said if I was able to pull that bracing out of the post, the wreck would be pretty bad.  

Jerry 

Mostly Mk2

If it was my face I would not be tempted by 2 points belts.  The period solution was a bolt through the B pillar with the bottom ends bolted throught the floor with spreader plates (maybe 1 1/2 X 3 inches) on the outside under the bolts.

I found that driving a friends 63 Cooper with no belts just too "uncomfortable" an experience to repeat...

Cheers, Ian

 

 

 

Any idea of how to mount these? There are no mounting points anywhere on the car. I looked at another Mini with belts and the mounts go into the center hump andd the inside sills but there is no way to get in there to pot a nut.

Yeah, good call Meb. After re-reading George's message, I realize he's talking a whole different animal. Still, the eyelet hook/snap setup was common on many of the pre-62 (850's anyway). Charliek, here's a link from our Host for a nice economy seatbelt set. I'd go with the basic lapbelts myself for some relative safety and a period look. The description from this link states, "These are the ideal belts for the early cars not just because of their looks but they are lap belt only with NO shoulder belt. Many early cars were not fitted with 3-point belts, and the earliest Minis didn't have a mounting point for them!"                               Mini Estate

//www.minimania.com/part/SEATBELT011/Seatbelt-Lap-Only-Vintage-Style-Seat-Belt

I may be wrong but I think geoO is referring to the following type

RESTORED 3 POINT SHOULDER AND LAP KANGOL SEAT BELTS FOR MERCEDES W113 W111 W109   From United States

Hi George,

Here's the hardware for the snap belts I think you are referring to, (first link). I don't believe the really early Minis had 3-point, (pre-1962), let alone retractable seat belts. Three or four of my orininal 850's had the eyelet bolts with the snap on ends for the non retractable standard lap belts. Charliek, you can order them that way. I will also post a link to show some nifty spring loaded seat belt retractors for standard seat belts. These things work great. I don't know why they are so much. I bought a couple pair cheap from a JCWhitney Catalog years ago and used them in my 1962 850 Austin Countryman Woodie Wagon. Just go with an inexpensive 2-point classic lap belt. You'll be fine. Your 848cc engines top speed is only 69mph, (and that's figuring the wind blowing the right way!) A 2-point point classic lap belt will be period correct for your Mini as well. Hope this helps.         Mini Estate

//www.seatbeltsplus.com/product/SnapHookSet.html

//www.seatbeltsplus.com/product/WB-RET-Chrome.html   

This type of belt is a magnetic belt which was used on many European cars in the 1960s, and was dealer installed. On Minis they were either Britax or Kangols which were also used on Mercedes-Benz. If you find an NOS set it would cost you dearly.

 

Love to have a copy of those pics as jpegs! 

My plan is to repaint the car in it's original red color so I guess anything I do to put in belts can be covered up.

Because if I get killed my wife will never talk to me again and, gets to keep ALL the money.

When I bought my '61 it came with waist belts which was fine for the 400 mile drive home with a support vehicle following right behind me.  But since I was adding a VTEC and planning to have the occasional track day I installed the Safety Devices roll bar with an added harness bar so I could at least run 4 point harnesses.

I feel anything less in a car this light weight and small with this much power would be irresponsible. Personally I wouldn't drive in any car over 30mph without 3 point belts. It would be like smoking your whole life - it might not kill you tomorrow but eventually it is going to catch up to you! 

I can't add to the discussion or solution, but this seems a good place to ask a question or look for a clarification. My first Mini was a RHD '63 850 and had three-point belts, but the clasp was just that, a "clasp" and not a push-in-click-socket kind of latch. It was a piece of metal that the end curved over (as if you'd bend your fingers in at the big knuckle) that hooked over a bar. I've never read any mention of such a thing, and I've seen other early Minis and never noticed this type of latch. Am I dreaming? Had the car in the late '60s early '70s. Long gone.

if you are doing this to appease someone else, and don't really care about the (rare) safety issue,

then....

why not just epoxy  it on?

LlMlni that was the point the factory style reinforced mounting isn't just an insert. I you look at one cut out of the car it is a long steel plate with the threaded piece as part of it to spread the load out over the pillar, which upon impact would keep the inertia of the weight of the person against the belt from ripping the insert right out of the pillar. The through post insert looks like, for lack of a better description a revolution wheel long sleeve lug nut only with a smaller radius button head on it so it didn't stick out too far and look like crap. It didn't have to be welded in because when tight it sandwiches the inside and outside of the pillar post making it so you would have to rip the whole pillar post out to get the belt mount to break away. I'm sure if the car isn't all painted you could weld some kind of reinforcement in, but when he said the wife won't let me drive the car I assumed it was a finished, painted, ready to drive car.

Would welding the old insert to the pillar on the outside compromise the integrity of it too much?  Dr Mini  says it had a "button head" on the outside, I'm guessing kind of like a carriage bolt?  Drill the hole for the through- insert, tack the outside button head to the pillar, grind, tack, grind, tack and fill to make smooth?  Or you could forego having to FIND the old insert- just find the right size threaded insert at your local hardware that is about an inch longer than needed.  Weld it inside and out, cut and grind it flush and fill the outside.  I'm not sure though that all the heating wouldn't be bad for the pillar, though.  And you'd have to paint....  

air2air can you please post a picture of hot the rectractable portion is set up?

charliek:

Have you tried the 'probablity theory' argument. As in: "Statistics show that in [enter country/state name] in the last 10 years no-one has ever been killed or seriously injured while driving or riding in a 1960 Mini." If you have the nerve, you might extend the statement to include any 1960 cars.

It is kind of like the theory that nobody ever gets hit by a bus while carrying high explosives.

 

aren't those "Ground2Air" photos?

1963SV2 you missed the part in my post I said install roll bar with shoulder belt anchors welded to the bar. If anyone has ever seen the California Mokes with the factory roll bar that is how they mounted the belts. Never suggested roll bar with no belts that would just add more metal to bounce your head off of... You can't just weld in the mounts to the pillars as the factory ones are a full reinforced piece inside the pillar to spread the stress over the whole pillar not just a nut welded inside the post. No way to do that without cutting the car apart. The reason the thru the post mount works is you are stressing the whole pillar not just the inside part of it. 4 point harness has no place to mount either as the rear parcel shelf spot welds have been known to rip out of the car when this was done in the old days for race cars. Banned by racing sanctioning bodies years ago and made to install a cross bar to roll bar and mount them there. You can't mount them down to the floor unless you want to crush your spine, look up reasons not to mount belts so they form a "V" when installed. Not my opinion it's not recommended by belt manufacturers. So as I said two structurally sound options are roll bar with mounts or the old thru the pillar mount.

Sorry but you will need to weld in mount points for a 3 point harness, another option would be a 4 point racing harness, you can buy these in std 2in seat belt webbing and would save any dubious welding into the 'B' pillar

Otherwise your second choice is.......................